Wagglepop 2: Deja Vu as Auction Site That Left Sellers Stranded Reopens

[chiquita]

Sneaky you rock !!!!

[chiquita]

Groupthink-

Irving Janis, who did extensive work on the subject defined groupthink as,

"A mode of thinking that people engage in when they are deeply involved in a cohesive in-group, when the members' strivings for unanimity override their motivation to realistically appraise alternative courses of action."

Symptoms of Groupthink:

His/Her eight symptoms indicative of groupthink:

  1. Illusion of invulnerability
  2. Unquestioned belief in the inherent morality of the group
  3. Collective rationalization of group's decisions
  4. Shared stereotypes of outgroup, particularly opponents
  5. Self-censorship; members withhold criticisms
  6. Illusion of unanimity (see false consensus effect)
  7. Direct pressure on dissenters to conform
  8. Self-appointed "mindguards" protect the group from negative information

His/Her seven symptoms of a decision affected by groupthink:

  1. Incomplete survey of alternatives
  2. Incomplete survey of objectives
  3. Failure to examine risks of preferred choice
  4. Failure to re-appraise initially rejected alternatives
  5. Poor information search
  6. Selective bias in processing information at hand (see also confirmation bias)
  7. Failure to work out contingency plans

Abiline Paradox-

The Abilene paradox is a paradox in which the limits of a particular situation force a group of people to act in a way that is directly the opposite of their actual preferences. It is a phenomenon that occurs when groups continue with misguided activities which no group member desires because no member is willing to raise objections. It was observed by management expert Jerry B. Harvey in his article The Abilene Paradox and other Meditations on Management.
On a hot afternoon visiting in Coleman, Texas, the family is comfortably playing dominoes on a porch, until the father-in-law suggests that they take a trip to Abilene (53 miles away to the north) for dinner. The wife says, "Sounds like a great idea." The husband, despite having reservations because the drive is long and hot, thinks that his preferences must be out-of-step with the group and says, "Sounds good to me. I just hope your mother wants to go." The mother-in-law then says, "Of course I want to go. I haven't been to Abilene in a long time."

The drive is hot, dusty, and long. When they arrive at the cafeteria, the food is as bad. They arrive back home four hours later, exhausted.

One of them dishonestly says, "It was a great trip, wasn't it." The mother-in-law says that, actually, she would rather have stayed home, but went along since the other three were so enthusiastic. The husband says, "I wasn't delighted to be doing what we were doing. I only went to satisfy the rest of you." The wife says, "I just went along to keep you happy. I would have had to be crazy to want to go out in the heat like that." The father-in-law then says that he only suggested it because he thought the others might be bored.

The group sits back, perplexed that they together decided to take a trip which none of them wanted. They each would have preferred to sit comfortably, but did not admit to it when they still had time to enjoy the afternoon.

 
Abilene paradox

The phenomenon may be a form of groupthink. It is easily explained by social psychology theories of social conformity and social cognition which suggest that human beings often feel great disincentives to acting in a manner contrary to the trend of the group. Likewise, it can be observed in psychology that indirect cues and hidden motives often lie behind peoples' statements and acts, frequently because social disincentives may exist which preclude individuals from openly voicing their feelings or pursuing their desires.

Note: Bolding is mine 

[Alskling]

Chiquita:

Groupthink IS Cultthink. I can see no difference in behavior, objective or motive. I know Poopers object to being called cultists, but that's what they are. Individuality has no place in Poopland. This is fine -- they can be whatever they please. IT'S JUST THAT THEY ARE NOT BUSINESS-PEOPLE and WAG-L-POOP IS NOT A BUSINESS, in any way, shape or form, in the capitolist, Western, USA sense of the word. The only ones who benefit from the business of cults are its leaders and this is not how successful American businesses are run. Innovation, free-thinking, freedom of expression and creative license to all associates are all part of the most successful business models. Wag-L-poop has none of these.

[thentavius]

As for Tulip Tool thread about Wagglepop. hmm we have people who are posting over 3,000 posts in order to get credits to advertise with Tulip Tool. I find it rather a pity and pity you all there that you can put all your negitive energy and time not well spent to talk about hard wroking sellers and sellers trying to inprove a auction venue. If you would take that energy and anger and turn it into a productive matter and actually make a effort to list and sell something then you might see what I have already done.

Actually, I think only TWO people so far have used the business advertising at TT.

[thentavius]

I wonder what they think of the OTWA thread?

I wonder what they would have thought of the FAS threads, in real-time, had they actually been around for Rip-Off #1.

[Platzki]

[quote author=thentavius link=topic=3775.msg32384#msg32384 date=1163867271]

As for Tulip Tool thread about Wagglepop. hmm we have people who are posting over 3,000 posts in order to get credits to advertise with Tulip Tool. I find it rather a pity and pity you all there that you can put all your negitive energy and time not well spent to talk about hard wroking sellers and sellers trying to inprove a auction venue. If you would take that energy and anger and turn it into a productive matter and actually make a effort to list and sell something then you might see what I have already done.

They said negitive.....

Not mention wroking and inprove...

They like the word pity.............pity

I guess they know more than us 'cause they sell on WP.  I say up your wazoo!!!!

[amy]

hmm we have people who are posting over 3,000 posts in order to get credits to advertise with Tulip Tool

hmm dumb ass popper, only 2 people have over 3,000 posts and they're both owners of "Tulip Tool"[sic] .

I wonder what they think of the OTWA thread?

Do you need to ask?  As soon as they read the posts where their fearless leader Ray said OTWA was worthless, they'll also think it is worthless. If Ray said a pile of shit was gold they would believe it.

[Alskling]

[quote author=amy link=topic=3775.msg32389#msg32389 date=1163870222]

Do you need to ask?  As soon as they read the posts where their fearless leader Ray said OTWA was worthless, they'll also think it is worthless. If Ray said a pile of wombat poo poo was gold they would believe it.

I think they all believe KaRay's own poopoo is gold! There's a thread over there proclaiming that "KAREN IS DA BOMB."

[chiquita]

I'm only posting cuz I need me some credits. How many for a TT bumper sticker? 

Ok I am also up for some pity, poor me, poor poor TT 

[chiquita]

Some comments made on OTWA prior to the launch of WP1

Wow, that's like 1000 people per day since the 3rd?

I just do not believe that. Nope. For a 'site' that isn't even up yet?

Why do I keep seeing a revival tent, smoky kerosene lanterns and a chest full of snakes?

I think deep down that most of the hobby sellers don't expect to sell anything at WP. They aren't selling on eBay anymore, and really have nothing to lose.

I think a lot of the Pro's will open free auctions, just on spec.

But the feeling I'm getting about the stores, is that its like a membership to a club.

They are willing to pay the fees just to call themselves poppers. So if the site goes down, they will all be very sympathetic.

Sort of a small town USA swap meet on an early Saturday spring morning, huh? Where Ann's stuff goes to Mary's house, and Mary's stuff goes to Sue's house, and Sue's stuff goes to Bob's house ... until they do it all over again in autumn?

For me, Ray's sales pitches always brought to mind those of Amway/Quixtar. Maybe Wagglepop will become the newest MLM on the block and Ray the new DeVos or VanAndel.

Re: a WP seller

What I don't understand, though, is why she seems to be taking her anger at eBay out on anyone who questions the Wagglepop way? Simple comments and innocent questions have earned scathing and sometimes nasty attacks by her. In fact several Wagglepop lurkers that I know have Pm'ed or emailed me to say that she, along with a couple of other frequent posters, scared them off and they will not have anything to do with Wagglepop as a result of this.

And one of the best ones by TR

There are 2 states of mind in which people are more likely to be conned.

1. They are being greedy
2. They are being overly hopeful

When people are overly hopeful, and they pin their hopes on something that isn't tangible (at least at the moment), they build a dreamscape reality around what they are hoping for will become. That doesn't mean it will become as they wish, but their dreamscape reality is built on it. Furkidmom doesn't want anything messing up her dreamscape reality. She believes that if enough people share her dreamscape reality, they can make it come true. Any view to the contrary diminishes the hope that a joint vision can will something to be what they want it to be...

So she looks at the shiny side of the nickel and the smaller that glint seems to be, the more she is prone to lash out. Ultimately, when the reality of Wagglepop hits (assuming it does actually get launched), Ray has sold all those people on a reality he cannot produce, and they cannot will into existence. Whether they blame Ray, blame eBay, or blame those who didn't drink the Kool-Aid and join their dreamscape reality is yet to be seen, but no matter how you slice it, they are being overly hopeful, and Ray's promises of the moon and the sky are promises upon which he can't deliver. Heck, I have serious doubts he can even deliver a dependable bus for them to drive out and look at the moon and the sky...