Wagglepop 2: Deja Vu as Auction Site That Left Sellers Stranded Reopens

[Alskling]

[quote author=BellisimaJ. link=topic=3775.msg32480#msg32480 date=1163951869]
Chiquita,

I just played with the gender genie.

I used posts from TT by myself, Askling and Thentavius.  Askling and I read as males. ???  Thentavius read as a female.

BOO gender genie! ;D
[/quote]

What a HOOT! I wonder if the Gender Genie would say my husband's female. Maybe that would explain a few things about our relationship.

Back to the subject:

Pooper comments on WP's AdSmart:

"Here we go! Down the same road as Ebay! With all the other problems on Wagglepop this is what they have been working on? Give me a break!"

Karen's response-- talking in tongues, and not addressing the concern, as usual:

"If you read the latest edition of The Revolution Newsletter, we've made a "six figure" commitment to both site features and functionality and a dedicated outside marketing campaign that will likely arrive around the second to third quarter of 2007.

Larger scale feature and functionality upgrades and marketing campaigns designed today take that long to produce and fund. Design and wireframing alone can be as long as 8-12 weeks if done properly. It's simply a technical and business reality.

There are lots of "already scheduled" and funded features and upgrades between now and then, and AdSmart is just one of them.

With proper placement, it could be an excellent way to attract some of the existing traffic to your Store and listings
Karen - WP Customer Care "

TRANSLATION: Since you've already so kindly supported us since May of this year by parting with $10/mo, every month, getting nothing but empty promises and no buyers in return, it's obvious our "hope and faith strategy" is working well enough to institute a new carrot to keep you on the hook for another year. And should you choose not to participate in the AdSmart program, then we can always say you have nobody but yourself to blame for not having sales, because you didn't take advantage of all the wonderful non-revenue producing features of our site. BTW -- What "six figure commitment?" $000,000 is nothing, but it's six figures, all right.

More Pooper response to AdSmart:

"Oh my. I'll be too nervous to click on anyone's ad for fear of costing them $0.10"

"O.K. where are we suppose to be seeing these ads? I have put in key words and done searches for those of you who have signed up and there are no ads. Also they do not show up on the home page. What are you getting for your $10.00 ?"

Obviously, this Pooper doen't understand the meaning of the term "intra-site".

[FineThings4U]

OOOOOOH, they just uncovered their big advertising plan - NOT

[Platzki]

Hey Fine Things!!! 

Glad to see you "again"!  I am a reformed popper and am glad to have this site to vent, make fun of and completely ridicule the site that took my money and gave back nothing!!

I went back to read more posts in response to adsmart...

YAY! A popper with a brain!
"Here we go! Down the same road as Ebay! With all the other problems on Wagglepop this is what they have been working on? Give me a break!"

Oh my.  I'd be too nervous to leave WP because I'm a complete idiot!
"Oh my. I'll be too nervous to click on anyone's ad for fear of costing them $0.10"

GIMME A BREAK!!!

[regic]

Apart from all the legal ramifications that may be associated with the use of the word AdSmart (it's almost as if Ray's TRYING to get his ass sued),

AdSmart is a registered federal trademark.  The odds of WP not being sued are non-existent.

[Alskling]

Let's do some math:
Let's say I am a WP seller with two featured stores. I sign up for AdSmart on each of these stores and get 1000 pity clicks, or 500 clicks per store from other Poopers over the course of the month.

$50 (store) + $50 (store) + $10 (sign up) + $10 (sign up) + $100 (cost for clicks) = $210/mo before I've sold a single item. Now, that's what I call value!  

Oh wait! I just read the last post. Ray's going to be putting that money to good use defending his ass in court.

[FineThings4U]

What are you getting for your $10.00

The same wombat poo poo that you got for the first ten bucks...nada.  RayKaren, of course, can add spinners to their new hot rides.

[Kaboing]

[quote author=Platzki link=topic=3775.msg32482#msg32482 date=1163952760]
Hey Bell!!!!


Hey Kaboing!!  How long have you been selling on WP?  I sold for two months there but could not stand Karen's disgraceful and condescending manner when she spoke to people who brought up REAL issues. 


[/quote]

I have been there since the beginning of August and have actually made a small profit after fees. While not a huge amount, every little bit helps. So, I have pretty much ignored the bad aspects of the site until adsmart. The adsmart really got to me for several reasons.

1.  They claim to be a trust based site, yet now require prepayment for the adsmart ads. Even the price of the clicks($0.10) is far too high for intra-site advertising on WP.  Two cents would have been more appropriate.

2.  The efforts should have gone into basic upgrades like implementing instant payments for buyers instead of having to rely solely on the cumbersome invoicing process.

[Alskling]

Another Pooper questioning AdSmart:

"Karen,
I read the newsletter. It is full of praise and coming soon. It does not address issues and upgrades that store owners have requested. Which I might add are VERY important to conduct business in a professional manner.

I found the projections that WP has set for itself and WP has surpassed it's breakeven point so it must now be profitable. Not only collecting fees for stores, but FVF's. Adding Adsmart is a revenue generator for WP, not an "advertising" plan or way to bring new buyers to the site which is more important than redirecting customers that are already here. Bringing in outside buyers not only generates income for store owners but for WP. Sales go up, WP earnings go up through FVF's.

I have been working on a spreadsheet and taking pictures of my products, I have over 2,000 items ready to go and many more to work on. (Quilts and Quilting products) I am starting to wonder if WP is the right choice since the issues that affect sellers most are on the back burner and revenue generation for WP is on the front.

I took some time a while back to read through all the community boards and invoicing, feedback and outside advertising have repeatedly been issues that sellers have brought up since the start of WP. I would think that they would be priority.

Dazed and confused "

Karen trying to convince the Pooper all is grand and not loose her 2,000 items ready to list:

"The basic reality is that we continue to operate monthly at a fiscal loss, as expected.

"Out of pocket" expense continues to be the shortfall in monthly revenues relative to expense, ongoing additional programming as required or requested, not to mention the considerable investment of capital required for the migration in mid-2007.

The extreme nature of SmartSell Pro at $9.95 and the corresponding uncollected revenue of free listings, free gallery images, and free BIN options severley limits overall revenues, but over the long-term, it's going to be an excellent solution for both membership and Wagglepop.

Monthly payable operating expenses include hosting of our dedicated servers, server administration, compensation of staff (hourly and contract) employees, rent and utilities, and various other expenses.

Programming certainly is not cheap. Every time a feature or functionality is requested, reviewed, and approved, that's an additional "out of pocket" expense above and beyond those noted above.

But that's business. In order to gain, you must be willing to risk, and as a company I think it's pretty clear that we have that sort of commitment to membership.

I'm not sure what more we could do to show that, and hope that you continue to grow with us when and where we can so that Wagglepop becomes a site your can buy and sell on comfortably.

We are working as absolutely hard as we can to make that happen

Karen - WP Customer Care" 

The bold is mine, since I thought this was a bit of a slam, trying to make Poopers feel guilty about not being grateful for all the blessings bestowed upon them through KaRay's undisputed self-sacrificing deed of denying itself out of all that money it should be charging sellers for listings and upgrades. YOU UNGRATEFUL POOPERS!

[regic]

--temporary hijack--

For the benefit of the Poppers who repeated Karen/Ray's "WP is beating ebayExpress" on Blogging Stocks:

The Blogging Stocks article helped us more than it helped Wagglepop.
Alexa daily traffic ranks for yesterday: TT: 25,536 eBayexpress.com 28,433 WP N/A (not in top 100,000)
Alexa 1 week traffic ranks: eBayExpress.com 26,470 WP 57,345 TT 61,601

--end hijack--

severley limits overall revenue

[Sweet Girl 70]

Karen,

I get more and more confused by your responses. I find more double talk then information.

A business plan and projections are based on revenues and expenses. When WP started some thought and planning went into the "break even" point and so on. I would hope those numbers were based on stores and sales. One would then presume that expenses would be taken into account as well. A business does not project a break even or profitable point without careful thought and planning. Based on your response, apparently some items were not taken into consideration.

As I stated, the more sales a store generates, the more money WP earns through Final Value Fees. So therefore bringing outside buyers would then be more of an advantage to sellers and WP than on site advertising. There are many methods of "Free" business advertising on the web that WP has not taken advantage of. When I do a search for Wagglepop I still get all the articles about the closing of the first Wagglepop. It has been 5 months now and those articles should be gone from the first page of search.

The store owners have put a lot of time and effort into their own advertising to try to draw customers here, in turn for their efforts the tools they need to build and maintain their customer base must then be supplied by WP to maintain the customer base.

Store owners are WP's customers and providing them with the tools they need to build their business will in turn generate revenue for WP. Or is it simpler looking for WP to generate cash through the Adsmart campaign?

I may need to rethink my choice of venues.

Alskling, I see the soon to be leaving "smart person" has responded to Karen.

  Kabong!! and FineThings!!!