Wagglepop 2: Deja Vu as Auction Site That Left Sellers Stranded Reopens

[thentavius]

Possible seller:

"I was considering selling here but this post has me rethinking that. Is it normal for you to discuss seller's details in an open board rather than through private emails? I would hate to see me financial information posted. Financial information such as whether a person has paid a bill or how the bill was incurred should be in private emails, not posted on the board for everyone to see. It doesn't make this site seem professional, secure and trustworthy when I see something like that." 

K/R's defense:

"The information about timelines, mimimum standards for payment, and how to make payment was worthwhile and useful information for all members to read."

Well, if the bolded part is true, KaRay, you could have at least edited out the dollar amounts. $X.XX, for example.

IF YOU'RE LOSING MONEY YOU'RE NOT DOING "VERY WELL", NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU'RE SELLING...just ask Brandon "Sell2All" who sold $8 million on eBay and spent $9.5 million doing it.

;D

[cash1381]

Posted by: chiquita 
Insert Quote
How many hardcore cheerleaders do you think are left? I recognize many of the names who have been on the boards for months.
Any idea? 

Also how many do you think are ready to bail??? 


 

Per the Thread; Assistance.. 10 reasons to open a store

Only about 9 or so.....and not a single seller mentioned....".Because I pay all my bills this way.."

(Just to see who was still in was the purpose of the thread and to shed some light on the fact no one is making any $$$$ there).
 

[Alskling]

[quote author=Sweet Girl 70 link=topic=3775.msg33466#msg33466 date=1164433307]
I need to chime in on something that I feel very strongly about.   

Yes, Wagglebutt is a cult and only looks out for Raybil. 
Yes, we should alert store owners on the site of the fraud that we see and most of us have experienced.

But...

We are playing with people's lives and their "business",  which for those poopers who don't go on the boards and don't know about the games that are played, it would be devastating, like it was for those of you who were part of WP1 when the site just shut down, if there was another site implosion without warning. 

I want to see Raybil go away and not take advantage of anyone ever again.  I don't want to cause problems for the people who are honestly trying to make a go of their stores and turn it into something.  We need to be careful, so we don't hurt the victims in all of this.
[/quote]

I've been thinking the same thing. We have to provide these folks with alternatives. They are really in a catch-22: The longer they stay, the more they'll lose. On the other hand, a full-on torbedo is headed WPs way and many poor Poppers will find themselves drowning in confusion, disillusionment and dispair -  a depressing place to be when you've put so much effort into a wasted endeavor. These guys need a safety net. PM-ing them is something I suggested on this thread a month or so ago, and I think someone else brought it up here recently. Since PMs are also monitored by K/R (another invasion of privacy, indicative of WPs fascist methods and cultist agenda), it's best to just PM members to let them know you have some valuable information and let them contact you.

Borgs who enjoy being cultists and cheerleaders have every right to do so. It's not a crime to be weird, bigotted, enjoy abuse, or belong to any exclusive society. We're simply giving the opportunity for Poppers to make an intended, well-informed choice. The purpose of this thread and other blogs is for educational purposes. K/R maintain control by insulating the faithful from the truth and access to avenues of education. Some will choose ignorance and denial, but at least they were given an option instead of falling into it by default. It will be a bitter pill for some cheerleaders when the cause for which they have put so much time, money and energy, blows up and crumbles before their eyes, but knowing there are options and it's not the end will help ease the pain for those who sink with the ship and help launch life boats for others.

[youroverheadbin]

Truth,  glad you made it over here. I knew you would feel at home!   

I spent a good bit of time yesterday contacting members of the collective about my ex-communication and the events that led up to it. These are sellers I dealt with through sales or got to know on the boards. A couple have emailed back. I'm hoping that even if the veil of faith isn't immediately removed, or they don't ask for more information, that I've at least planted seeds of doubt. Ironically I used as example the previous thread mentioning financial info, the Borg Queen's response, the removed post by you know who, and the email of reprimand received Thanksgiving day as part of my evidence. So it is perfect that CC1 has stumbled again mentioning personal finances. . So typical of the "no one's going to tell me what to do" attitude that was portrayed during the WP1 fiasco.

This latest error in judgment just substantiates what I related to them. Thanks Karay! And if they become convinced that some of what I told them is true they will hopefully give credence to the rest and start learning the entire truth for themselves.

Truth, you mentioned PMing them. Here's another way. I've been looking through their auctions, looking for errors. Errors in listing category, spelling (lots of those) etc. I sent an email "ask seller a question" to politely inform them of this error and mentioned I'm gone and briefly why. This puts them in a thankful frame of mind and since I was known to be a supporter in good standing, their curiousity is piqued by the rest of my message. I don't expect instant results but it's a start. I'm of the same mind as Suthrnjewl that if I can save one...  The advantage of sending contact through seller question is that they can respond to me directly and do not have to go through WP's mail system.  A dam doesn't just spontaneously burst - it starts with little cracks in the structure.

I remember an incident my ex had. He was speeding down Alligator Alley and was pulled over by highway patrol and given a ticket. When the ex questioned why me, stating everyone else was going the same speed, the cop responded with a southern drawl, "Ah know, but I kin only git ya one at a time."

[Platzki]

I feel very bad about it too.  BUT they have been conditioned by Ka/Ray, fellow Borg and their own minds to continue on the way they are.  I still think that in order to help someone, they have to be willing to help themselves.  Some Borg are starting to see the light... there are just those stubborn (very, very) few that just keep insisting that with faith, they will help WP succeed.

Let's not forget that at last count, WP still had over 650 stores, 20-30 of which have sellers that post on the boards... what about the other 600+ sellers that belong yet don't participate in the boards so they have no idea what's going on!?!?!?!

I don't want to see anyone suffer or go down with the WP ship that Ray is so insistent on keeping afloat until he squeezes every last nickel out of these people... but I really think that no matter how hard we try to convince people, some just won't give in and will eventually drown in their own faith.

It's sad but sometimes you just have to let people make their own mistakes.  I am so glad that I got out of there when I did.  

[youroverheadbin]

Alsking, you bring up a very valid point. It could be futile tossing them a lifeline if it isn't solidly anchored to something.

[eclectica]

Wow... literally pages added and I'm trying to catch up!

[quote author=youroverheadbin link=topic=3775.msg33502#msg33502 date=1164469133]
Alsking, you bring up a very valid point. It could be futile tossing them a lifeline if it isn't solidly anchored to something.
[/quote]

[quote author=Platzki link=topic=3775.msg33501#msg33501 date=1164468706]
I feel very bad about it too.  BUT they have been conditioned by Ka/Ray, fellow Borg and their own minds to continue on the way they are.  I still think that in order to help someone, they have to be willing to help themselves.  Some Borg are starting to see the light... there are just those stubborn (very, very) few that just keep insisting that with faith, they will help WP succeed.

[/quote]

Interesting that we all seem to kind of fall on the same page. I do feel bad for those that are being taken advantage of but when you're offered alternatives or have things made apparent to you and still refuse to budge - well, there's only so much you can do. I really would hate to see people hurt by Ray pulling the plug without warning, but I honestly believe that for some, that will be the only way the message truly sinks in. Even then, I'd place my bets there will still be a couple defending and cheering after the site has gone *poof*. Hopefully by putting the information out there, the fall (which I think is inevitable) will be softened as Alskling suggests.

[let the truth be told]

Hi,

I agree with everthing that has been said and I also don't want anyone to get hurt other than ray. That is why I chose the user name here that I did "let the truth be told". In my last few emails to ka/ray I stated the truth sahll set you free and it did for me. I spent the last two months there questioning in the forums and emails to ka/ray. I managed to help several sellers there find better places to sell or buy.

The way I see it is this. The faster we can save the sellers at wagglepop from losing money each month the less hurt they will feel. I have gotten nothing but thanks from people that have left because of me. 2007 is going to be a great year for sites like ecrater and blujay. Think about it there are alot of people who don't like to sell on ebay and wagglepop but want to sell somewhere else for free!!! We see it and talk about it all the time. Having your own website to sell from is great as well.

Well I think everyone here is on the same page. As I said I am willing to do anything to help the sellers there make there move.

let the truth be told as I tip toe through the tulips
u1it4less - "it's all in the name..."

p.s. updates are being done today to my website u1it4less.com tune in latter to see how we rate wagglepop you won't want to miss it!!!

[Sweet Girl 70]

Wow, I am so glad that I am not the only one that feels this way.  I may have anger issues but I am not cold and callous (I do have a cold and am a little snotty  )

Save the poppers, one at a time and spread the word of truth. 

Raybil is the bad guy in all of this and the others are his victims.  I like the idea of PM's and the approach of letting them know something is wrong in a listing then telling them a bit of truth.  Thinking about it, remember I said something about the moment the hair stood up on the back of my neck, we need to give them a hair raising moment.  Then let them decide.

I don't see anyone here as malicious or Ray-like. I think we are all above that. 

Ok, so can we get back to laughing now cause I don't want to cry anymore  :'(

[let the truth be told]

sweet girl 70

Please don't cry you might melt. But if you do save those tears for ka/ray I here sugar water burns the eyes so send them to me I will spray them on ka/ray. Don't forget I live very close to wagglepop.



let the truth be told
u1it4less - "it's all in the name..."