Wagglepop 2: Deja Vu as Auction Site That Left Sellers Stranded Reopens

[FineThings4U]

I remember him using romeo361, romeo362 and paper272 over on ebay as well.

:

[stardust]

JOE, I don't really believe anyone thinks you are stalking anyone else, nor wishing them harm, no matter what your frustrated, angry words say.  But the publishing of (or hinting at) personal information on forum boards is pretty much considered to be rather uncool, if only because there ARE sick people out there who CAN and WILL use the information in a harmful way.

The *stalking* word has been used on this forum lately with total abandon as to what it really means, and I don't think it should be used here in this thread to describe your attempt to educate people about the wp site and what it represents. Nor to describe your angry words at RR with regard to his deeds towards you or anyone else, and the pursuit of your goal of shutting wp down.

I do think, however, that you should consider editing out anything to do with his actual home address or personal possessions as a matter of principle.  I believe that's all that's got folks a bit riled on this board, as they see it as not good.

Ray Rhodes will eventually do himself in with his own words and actions, and the sooner the better.  Please do carry on.   

[Alskling]

STARDUST: WELL PUT!

We all know what Ray's game is, and just because he does no advertising, doesn't necessarily mean he's pulling a scam. HE'S PULLING A SCAM BECAUSE WHAT HE HAS CREATED IS SOMETHING THAT, IN REALITY, IS SOMETHING OTHER THAN WHAT HE CLAIMS IT TO BE, and taking innocent people's money in the process for purely personal glorification and gain.

He doesn't have a bona-fide auction venue, a trust-based e-commerce community, a staff of technicians working 24/7 to keep the site viable and timely. He hasn't invested six figures as he claims. He makes promises he can't deliver. He cons people into sending him money, and what do they receive in return? Cyber-breakfasts and prayers. He smothers criticism, bannishes those who ask clearly objective business questions for which he cannot answer, believes himself above everybody and the law. NEED I SAY MORE?

HE'S NOT RUNNING A BUSINESS, HE'S RUNNING A CULT, spreading some twisted version of insanity called KaRayism, and those he has managed to pursuade to join his crusade are paying homage to a guy who is a hypocrite with a known, devious past. The only part about his operation that remotely resembles business is that members are REQUIRED by contract to financially support the cult leader's "vision". This is what makes what he's doing so incideous, as most religious organizations that I know of survive through donations and quasi-business, non-profit activities like thrift stores, bake sales, bingo nites, etc., all of which are voluntary.   

And I do agree, that repeating some of what may have been said before is not a wasted excercise in redundancy. It is a long thread -- there are lurkers, and some of what's going on bears repeating in many places to make sure it is seen.

Although I'm sure your intentions are honorable, Truth, as Stardust has so tactfully said, you kinda need to fly low and avoid the radar on a public forum such as this one. Being close to the source can serve us all well in exposing the KaRay plot, but it can also be dangerous.

[Sweet Girl 70]

JOE, I don't really believe anyone thinks you are stalking anyone else, nor wishing them harm, no matter what your frustrated, angry words say.  But the publishing of (or hinting at) personal information on forum boards is pretty much considered to be rather uncool, if only because there ARE sick people out there who CAN and WILL use the information in a harmful way.

The *stalking* word has been used on this forum lately with total abandon as to what it really means, and I don't think it should be used here in this thread to describe your attempt to educate people about the wp site and what it represents. Nor to describe your angry words at RR with regard to his deeds towards you or anyone else, and the pursuit of your goal of shutting wp down.

I do think, however, that you should consider editing out anything to do with his actual home address or personal possessions as a matter of principle.  I believe that's all that's got folks a bit riled on this board, as they see it as not good.

Thank you Star, you summed up what I was feeling about the posts Truth made about personal information. 

Truth, I truly feel your intentions are good and that you are working to help others, the amount of personal information shared is/was my concern.  Carry on!! 

[Kaboing]

A new interesting read on the WP forum. While the post does raise some questions about WP advertising, it does not make broad accusations nor attack WP in a negative manner.  Its simply states the sellers opinions, concerns and experiences. It will be interesting to see if this post gets deleted. Since, this is the type of posts that should be allowed on a store forum.

(its not my post)

Here's my experience.

After the fee increase at the other site, I opened my WP store and 3 others. Closed one fairly quickly.

So now, I list on E (only auctions and only about 8 a month), I have a store here which I am focusing my stock on, I have another store that I have same items but only about 15 items, and another store with only about 10 items (same stuff as I have here).

Just this week, I've had sales on all 3 other venues...none here. I have de-listed 2 items here because they sold elsewhere (not ebay).

I'm using same marketing procedures for all 3 (other than E). The only difference is that the other 2 took advantage of the fee increase and started aggressively marketing and making serious upgrades to attract sellers and buyers.

I'm getting slightly discouraged. Like I mentioned, I am putting my time & effort in my inventory here and just putting a couple of things on other sites to "test the waters". Why are they selling everywhere but here?

Now I am beginning to doubt (regret) my decision to make this my major selling source and stocking the shelves here instead of somewhere else.

Am I crazy or is there a marketing campaign in the future which will increase our sellers and buyers?

I still have tons of stuff to list...but wondering what I should do.

I'm doing all I can......
I've brought a new buyer from elsewhere as well.

Wish I could find the sellers. We need to stock our shelves.

[youroverheadbin]

youroverheadbin,

I agree that everyone should read this entire thread and I have, took a long time to do so. I also agree with "educate the present sellers on WP who are oblivious to what is really going on" and I am. I have tried to expose new info rather than old info and I have (see wagglefacts) even if it was old to this thread it was proven if it was left unproven. I have been given info from many people even you and have been asked to research that info and expose the facts & I have. I have been attached by Ray as recent as last night because of providing info that people want to hear. There is no pathological vendetta. I have done what I was asked to do and put myself in Ray's sights. He has pushed me and I will push back it is as simple as that.

I don't disagree with you that my tactics my seem strong. That is done with a purpose to sellers who have not joined wp as of yet. It is those people whom I wish to help avoid making the mistake of joining WP as well as the curent sellers.

I am not sure if you know this but you can now google wagglefact. My goal is to provide truthfull info so people will be able to judge for themselves wheather to join or to leave.

Yes Sherry there is plenty of wind in your sail and We respect you for it. Because of the respect we have for you we will not have the wagglefact game on TT instead we will have it in our own forum. The wagglefact of the day will also switch to our forum later this week until then I will continue to post it here on TT. Once our forum is up you will not see us on TT as much. I will have to much to do so my time here will be less.

I am glad you said what you said as I can handle the truth just as much as the next person. I thankyou for all you have done for us.

JOE aka the truth

Good morning truth,

Sometimes it is so hard to relate through this medium what is really at the heart of a post. I hope you understood mine. You have and will always have my 100% support in exposing the fallacies of WP and Karay. And to date you are doing a terrific job so please do not slow down on that front. I wasn't around when WP1 imploded but I have read of the accusations Ray made of receiving death threats and stalking at that time. Who knows how valid these claims were? Did he actually receive them or did he take words of a personal nature expressed by someone, words such as you wrote, and convince himself they constituted a threat? We have all seen examples of his mental instability when confronted head on and he does seem, at least to me, to jump to conclusions. You are valuable to the cause and I just don't want to see you barrel into harm's way considering who you are dealing with. Expose his business practices, his character flaws, his scams but leave his personal life out of it. That is what I meant because I was really getting concerned.

As far as repeating information, a valid point. Some of it does merit repeating. I didn't say this part very well and I apologize  but I was trying to suggest, instead of spending your time digging externally for it, use the search function here and save yourself some time you could devote elsewhere. Example, type in rscript and you'll see lots of hits.

I hope I have explained myself better today. And I'll keep to flow of information coming your way. Friends? 

JOE, I don't really believe anyone thinks you are stalking anyone else, nor wishing them harm, no matter what your frustrated, angry words say.  But the publishing of (or hinting at) personal information on forum boards is pretty much considered to be rather uncool, if only because there ARE sick people out there who CAN and WILL use the information in a harmful way.

The *stalking* word has been used on this forum lately with total abandon as to what it really means, and I don't think it should be used here in this thread to describe your attempt to educate people about the wp site and what it represents. Nor to describe your angry words at RR with regard to his deeds towards you or anyone else, and the pursuit of your goal of shutting wp down.

I do think, however, that you should consider editing out anything to do with his actual home address or personal possessions as a matter of principle.  I believe that's all that's got folks a bit riled on this board, as they see it as not good.

Ray Rhodes will eventually do himself in with his own words and actions, and the sooner the better.  Please do carry on.  Smiley

Yea, what Star said, and done better than I did...

[FineThings4U]

Well, I guess KaRay has been so busy deleting posts and accounts they don't have time to do a newsletter.  They just changed the November edition of The Revolution to be the November/December edition.  Still the same old we can do better rah rah rah, blah blah blah.

I agree that the truth needs to be told.  I want the wagglefact of the day.  I just want you to be very careful.  We all know that Ray is verrrrry paranoid.

[let the truth be told]

And I do agree, that repeating some of what may have been said before is not a wasted excercise in redundancy. It is a long thread -- there are lurkers, and some of what's going on bears repeating in many places to make sure it is seen.

I would like to take the time to get this thread back on track. The above statement says most of it. What it does miss is to continue on investigating new facts about the scam and report as well as repeat known information. I think we can all agree I have done both. Some may disagree with some of the info that I have revealed and I can accept that. It is my choice to do so based on the facts presented and info gathered directly from the WP site. I will however refrain from any posts that reveal any personal info or facts that I have gathered from the local area ever again on this thread as well as posible reports to the authorites.

All I ask is that this thread continue to be a place to expose the facts about the WP scam so as to prevent anyone from joining the cult. I hold no grudges towards anyone on this thread & I would like to thank stardust for sticking around, you have been on this thread for a long long time! There has been a day wasted on judging my tactics and that day should have been spent exposing Ray for what he is A SCAM ARTIST!

With that said I would consider this issue closed!


let the truth be told
u1it4less - "it's all in the name.."
X-POP NATION

[sneakymagenta]

Ridin The Sales Slump Out (by R-AY-O Wagglewagon)

Ridin' the Sales Slump out, waitin' for the buyers to come out
On a full moon night in the Waggly Buyerless winter.
My koolaid bottle's low, watching for the sells
I've been thinking lately of what I'm missing in the eBay.

And I'm  missing everything
Watchin' the full moon crossing the range
Ridin' the Sales Slump out
Ridin' the Sales Slump out.

KaRay's beside me, she's there to guide me.
She says that alone we've finally found home.
The wind outside is frightening,
but it's kinder than the lightning life in the eBay.
It's a hard life to live but it gives Ray what you give.

[Alskling]

[quote author=Kaboing link=topic=3775.msg35308#msg35308 date=1165423124]
A new interesting read on the WP forum. While the post does raise some questions about WP advertising, it does not make broad accusations nor attack WP in a negative manner.  Its simply states the sellers opinions, concerns and experiences. It will be interesting to see if this post gets deleted. Since, this is the type of posts that should be allowed on a store forum.

(its not my post)

Here's my experience.

After the fee increase at the other site, I opened my WP store and 3 others. Closed one fairly quickly.

So now, I list on E (only auctions and only about 8 a month), I have a store here which I am focusing my stock on, I have another store that I have same items but only about 15 items, and another store with only about 10 items (same stuff as I have here).

Just this week, I've had sales on all 3 other venues...none here. I have de-listed 2 items here because they sold elsewhere (not ebay).

I'm using same marketing procedures for all 3 (other than E). The only difference is that the other 2 took advantage of the fee increase and started aggressively marketing and making serious upgrades to attract sellers and buyers.

I'm getting slightly discouraged. Like I mentioned, I am putting my time & effort in my inventory here and just putting a couple of things on other sites to "test the waters". Why are they selling everywhere but here?

Now I am beginning to doubt (regret) my decision to make this my major selling source and stocking the shelves here instead of somewhere else.

Am I crazy or is there a marketing campaign in the future which will increase our sellers and buyers?

I still have tons of stuff to list...but wondering what I should do.

I'm doing all I can......
I've brought a new buyer from elsewhere as well.

Wish I could find the sellers. We need to stock our shelves.

[/quote]

I'm not sure if this is the same seller that posted back around August, but the strategy and phrasiology make it appear as if it could be.

At that time a seller said he was, quote, "testing the waters", and putting the same or similar items on several venues to see where he got the most action -- one, of course, being WP. He was concerned about the lack of hits on his WP listings and no sales. The cheerleaders at that time got all over his case, accusing him of being non-commital and half-hearted. They also questioned how he can properly "access" the value of WP without having at least 100 items (as that was the magic number at the time), so he should stock his shelves and work his buns off in promotion before he could consider himself qualified to make a judgment call on the value of WP. If it is the same seller, it's apparent he's taken the advice to heart.

Now that he is qualified to make that call (accordingly to the cheerleaders' own standards)  how do you suppose they'll explain away his lack of success, which seems to be singular to WP and none of the other venues? There's gotta be an explanation, right? LIKE IT'S NOT A BUSINESS perhaps.

KaRay couldn't give a rat's ass about buyers, which is why KaRay will NEVER waste $$ on advertising. Buyers are considered a random by-product, and all the efforts Poppers do to promote the site are ultimately for KaRay's benefit not theirs. As long as enough sellers hang around at any given time, sending money every month on each and every store (some of which are costing $50/mo each to have their banner displayed on the home page for the benefit of Poppers who already know the store's there), not to mention all the revenue created by taking advantage of that great in-house "member-centric" promotional gimmick called AdSmart, KaRay have a steady, healthy income. Poppers who leave with little or no sales have NOTHING/NADA/ZIP/ZERO/ZILTCH/SQUAT to show for all their efforts (some are even in the hole), and all the hard work they put into site-recognition gets left behind for KaRay to enjoy and use as a tool to recruit more fools and maybe even sell a mag ad or baseball card here and there off of all the stores they'd created to pad up the listing tote board. IT'S SO FRICKIN' OBVIOUS.

P.S. Regarding the "wish I could find the sellers" comment from the Popper above, just wait and see how they all encourage him to  

EDIT: Did the post get pulled from the WP board? Seems nowhere to be found!